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Post by rrguitar1 on Dec 3, 2007 21:18:50 GMT -5
Hey guys, its been a long itme since posting here. I have a question about mixing pentatonic scales. this seems confusing for some reason to me...
Take key of Key of E minor for referance purposes, the notes of the key of E minor are: E F# G A B C D. What pentatonic scales can be found in this key?
The most obvious and predictable one is E minor pentatonic (E G A B D).
However, there are two other minor pentatonic scales that can be picked out.
One can also find B minor pentatonic (B D E F# A) and A minor pentatonic (A C D E G).
Now, let's use the premise of an E minor or E minor7 chord that you have to play a line over.
The point is that you can also play the B or A minor pentatonic scales over it, for a
more "outside" sound, although it's perfectly diatonic. The sound of the A minor pent over E might be a bit odd, but the sound of B minor over it sounds quite natural
This is what I found online. seems interesting, but I am having a hard time hearing the connection with the B and A minor pent scales over an E minor chord.
if I start on the E of the B pent and E on the A pent, it helps alittle but my ears do not fit it that well with the E monor chord
any help on this?
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Post by thenotshredder on Dec 3, 2007 22:32:29 GMT -5
I don't understand your confusion, I'm afraid. What exactly are you having trouble with?
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Post by Stefvorcide on Dec 4, 2007 0:57:29 GMT -5
well, over Eminor... B penta is the perfect 5th, and A is a 4th...
5th always sounds "stable" (i.e. less tension) than 4th, which sounds odd for some people. And I think Zakk wylde use alot of that B penta over Em, and it sounds killer.
to me it sounds good tho, so maybe thats because you're not used to it (well, i like twisted things so i might not be the perfect one to guide you ;p)
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Post by rrguitar1 on Dec 4, 2007 7:12:55 GMT -5
I guess I will mess with it more then to try and hear the connections. Thanks for the input guys.
thenotshredder:
the problem I am encountering is that I dont think the scale "fits" well with the chord.
ie... B pent over E minor chord
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Post by thenotshredder on Dec 4, 2007 9:28:33 GMT -5
Ah. Well, that's just a matter of taste and ears, dude. ;p
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Post by mattjem7vwh on Dec 5, 2007 0:58:37 GMT -5
haha... some scales just take some time to sink in and sound right.. its all about note choice... (and if you cant make a good note choice, i find playing a bizzilion notes a second tends to help.... people ignore the fact that it sounds shit and go WOW.. hes fast hahaha.)
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Post by rrguitar1 on Dec 5, 2007 13:45:28 GMT -5
I hear ya, I think that because i didnt have a backing track to go in front orf may have been a reason for not hearing it all the way.
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Post by rrguitar1 on Dec 5, 2007 21:16:05 GMT -5
Okay, since we are on the subject... how about mixing pentatonics and diatonics in leads. I have been putting together patterns in key of A minor all across the fretboard. Ie... overlaping the A minor pent blues scale all across the board with the A minor scale. I am outting them into patterns overlaping each other so I can go in and out all over. I am also going to add the A dorian and then A phrygian to those. SO I will have the four different scales to overlap and eventually add more. I have always bee stuckj to the pentatonic scale and I went crazy after a while feeling i was in a rut. Does anyone have any advise on this topic?
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Post by thenotshredder on Dec 6, 2007 0:06:18 GMT -5
It all depends on the chord you're playing over. If you're playing in the key of A minor, but the current chord is D minor (the IV), A Dorian might sound pretty off. I sure don't like it.
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Post by Tungus on Dec 6, 2007 2:57:19 GMT -5
I do strange shit....... I mix aeolean and phrygain just to see how shitty I can make it sound. Im not what you call a guy that thinks in the box. Yall remember Loycot? He thinks Im insane. "does that work"? NO, but its fun to mess around with it. The way I see it.... Ill never make any money off of the music biz.... may as well poke/have fun with it.
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schweinhund
IG Old Sk00l Badass
She's a maniac on the floor
Posts: 677
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Post by schweinhund on Dec 6, 2007 6:56:10 GMT -5
I strongly suggest you take (classical) theory lessons (intervals n' chords and writing music shit) and learn about the theory of chords, how they're built and why they are built that way. It explaines everything that is so hard to explain one guitar player to another. Then you'd find that in the key of E-minor the IV (4th chord/seat) is A-minor and the V (5th) is B-minor. There for the B-minor and A-minor scale's exist within the E-minor pentatonic but there are different notes 'showing' as in it's not exacly B-minor pentatonic but it is B-minor. However, since it is the minor 3rd that defines minor so it's not as crystal clear that the B-minor is a minor so that leaves you space to play around with. Em-pentatonic: root (E), minor-3rd, 4th, 5th, minor-7th A-minor in E-pentatonic: root (A), 2nd, 4th, 5th, minor-7th B-minor scale in E-pentatonic: root (B), minor-3rd, 4th, minor-6th, minor-7th Now if you use Am-pentatonic over E-minor chord you'll be replacing the 5th from E-minor (B) with the minor-6th from E-minor (C), hence the only difference between Am-pentatonic and E-m pentatonic is that you start from A instead of E and B is replaced by C. Both B and C belong in both scales but play a different role there. Fairly simple. If we do that with Bm-pentatonic over E-minor we'll get F# (F-sharp) instead of G, that is 2nd instead of minor-3rd if we think in the key of E-minor. Both notes are in the key of E-minor but the 2nd is not in the pentatonic scale. Now we have created a new scale variation of E-minor (root, 2nd, 4th, 5th and minor-7th) with a different flavour/feel than the regular pentatonic.. The best way to deal with this kinda shit is to learn the a scale from every note of it (for example: Aeolian, Dorian, Phrygian, Lydian, Mixolydian, Minor and Locrian) and think of it as the same scale, just beginning from another note. Now we see that minor is a part of major and vica versa, it's all the same scale! Now go and learn some freaky hindu/gipsy scales that defies everything in western musical theory and still sounds superb...
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schweinhund
IG Old Sk00l Badass
She's a maniac on the floor
Posts: 677
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Post by schweinhund on Dec 6, 2007 6:59:24 GMT -5
wow.. kinda lost it in the rant there .. Btw. Tungus! It's called bepop (Putting together to scales that have only one different note or adding the extra note into the scale (exacly the same thing)) and it makes the world go round ;D
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Post by rrguitar1 on Dec 6, 2007 9:45:59 GMT -5
Thanks for all of that! It makes sence being that the B and A are minor in E. Thanks for al of that explanation !!
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schweinhund
IG Old Sk00l Badass
She's a maniac on the floor
Posts: 677
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Post by schweinhund on Dec 6, 2007 19:00:47 GMT -5
No prob.. now go surf the interenet or better yet: Go to a local musical school and sign up for theory!
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