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Post by Stefvorcide on Sept 16, 2008 18:30:45 GMT -5
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Post by Torkin on Sept 17, 2008 6:23:29 GMT -5
:/
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Post by Joel Wanasek on Sept 17, 2008 7:49:13 GMT -5
For a long time I adhered to that philosophy and I wondered why my stuff never felt as polished as some of the stuff I referenced. Then I threw out all the things I wasn't supposed to do like clip/limit my masters/over compress/over eq etc.... and no shit..... that was what I was missing. My clients tripled in the studio and my recordings got a lot closer to what I was hearing the big boys put out. I read on message boards everyday now horrible everyone thinks the loudness wars are as well as using too much compression. I say **** off. I don't care. I like the sound of pushing the piss out of my mixes (when I do heavier stuff). It sounds better to my clients and they pay my rent so..... Until the industry standard changes, I'll pump em out loud and proud! In fact, in about 20 minutes a kick ass death metal band is showing up and guess what, they want there mix loud as hell. Can't wait! \m/ If I learned anything in life and business it is this: Follow the money
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Post by thenotshredder on Sept 17, 2008 12:27:11 GMT -5
And there's something wrong with saying "fuck you" to the industry standard? The hilarious bit about overcompression is that radio stations compress the shit out of their songs before playing them anyway.
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Post by deathsguitarist on Sept 17, 2008 12:44:00 GMT -5
the thing is...if you want to make money you have to follow the industry standards
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Post by endless on Sept 17, 2008 13:05:28 GMT -5
The human ear naturally likes loud, so of course people are going to think its awesome...at first.
This phenomenon has ruined many a CD for me. Listening gets really old, really fast.
I prefer quality over quantity, both in volume/dynamics and in the music itself. This is the opposite of what the industry currently promotes in every step from songwriting to mastering. Cheap, fast, easy, and short lived for maximum profit.
Fuck the industry. Fuck the standards.
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Post by thenotshredder on Sept 17, 2008 17:30:53 GMT -5
The human ear naturally likes loud, so of course people are going to think its awesome...at first. This phenomenon has ruined many a CD for me. Listening gets really old, really fast. I prefer quality over quantity, both in volume/dynamics and in the music itself. This is the opposite of what the industry currently promotes in every step from songwriting to mastering. Cheap, fast, easy, and short lived for maximum profit. Fuck the industry. Fuck the standards. Hear, hear.
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Post by Stefvorcide on Sept 17, 2008 22:07:54 GMT -5
Fuck the industry. Fuck the standards. +1 Anyway, HEAVEY METAL is *ALL* about rebellion and not following pop and trends. Yet so many so-called metal band are playing pop with "heavy" guitars and pounding drums... F*** 'EM If I learned anything in life and business it is this: Follow the moneyI'm sorry, but you can't be proud of something like this. It's the American-way-of-thinking as i call it, fast money with shit product. I'd rather do the best thing I could do, like GERMANS, ITALIANS etc. but it's up to you, ppl wants what you do (I guess), and pay. With the begining of CD's they used a " -6 Db " rule, so it does sounds loud, but doesn't clip or distort. There's a way to sound modern, but still good, if you don't abuse the compression/limiter/gate etc ADD: there's a video with Iron Maiden exemples, starting from the first album to the current sound, and to be honnest, after 90 something, I can't listen to their stuff at all. The 2003 album sounds like total shit, it's not pleasing at all. and Maiden havent changed their style much, so it's all about the tone/sound here... ADD 2: And I will also point the FACT that so many people, including musicians, doesnt know how use their sences, so they have no-hearing or no pallet (fine food, wine) Hence why Mcfastfood/tacobell are popular, amongst others. ADD 3: WOULDYOULIKETOREADAWHOLEBOOKLIKETHIS?? YOULOSTALLTHERYTHMFROMTHETEXT IT'STHESAMEASHYPERCOMPRESSION IMO /END RANT
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Post by endless on Sept 18, 2008 13:39:06 GMT -5
lol...so true. It's now easier to market crap than to make a decent product. Just like cars, appliances, etc. I saw the maiden video, too. I'm gonna have to listen to their new stuff again. Cranking your stereo sounds great. Cranking it before it gets to your stereo isn't so great. Maybe not the best example, but Dissections 'Reinkaos' album, while a little compressed, sounds fucking good, because nothing's clipping on any system I put it in. Clear, warm, balanced sound. Turn your volume up a bit and it hits you with 10 times the force of 'standard' production. It sounds louder at the same dB. Dissection-God of Forbidden LightI think the loudness thing is comparable to scooping mids. Popular, but counter-productive.
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Post by Joel Wanasek on Sept 18, 2008 13:45:58 GMT -5
Fuck the industry. Fuck the standards. +1 Anyway, HEAVEY METAL is *ALL* about rebellion and not following pop and trends. Yet so many so-called metal band are playing pop with "heavy" guitars and pounding drums... F*** 'EM If I learned anything in life and business it is this: Follow the moneyI'm sorry, but you can't be proud of something like this. I'm proud that I get to do something I love everyday and get paid for it. I'll take clipping my mixes over sitting in a cubicle running credit scores and underwriting loans any day. Nothing is wrong with hating the industry or challenging the order. However, having a **** the industry purist attitude is great until you actually decide that you want to make a living doing something else other than teaching guitar. The industry doesn't need you or I to go on and it will continue to prosper. It is what it is.
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Post by deathsguitarist on Sept 18, 2008 17:30:40 GMT -5
and that is the bottom line.
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Post by Tungus on Sept 19, 2008 0:24:20 GMT -5
1. Thanks for backin me up (RIAA bullshit included). 2. fux sake Joel.. if you had tits... id propose. (no fag jokes please...Im strait... but thats just wrong.
See the humor in it.
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Post by Joel Wanasek on Sept 19, 2008 7:37:07 GMT -5
1) Suing children is pathetic Anyone want the new Metallica? haha j/k 2) LOL! Sorry, I'm taken. Then again, my wife may of had enough of my crap by now?
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Post by Joel Wanasek on Sept 19, 2008 13:23:24 GMT -5
Aside from all the debating....ya know.... one thing I will say about loudness wars is this:
I've recorded and mastered a lot of records. I've tried it all and spent many hours experimenting with different types of mastering. I can't vouch for anyone else, but personally when it comes to mastering, I try to find a balance. I get the master where it is loud and proud, but I can't hear any distortions on the guitars. I try to find where the mix clips and has audible distortions, and then back off a few db. One thing I never try to do is get louder or as loud as a major label release. I hate the sound of clipping (like the last RedHotChiliPeppers cd was terrible!!!). I try to ball park, but be on the lower end of the trend.
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Post by thenotshredder on Sept 19, 2008 16:20:09 GMT -5
We are probably all arguing at cross purposes, then.
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