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Post by entz on Jun 29, 2007 3:20:06 GMT -5
If you ask me... most of the stuff in rock music blows these days.... modern rock, metalcore, metal... whatever.... there are SOME decent bands.... but most of them.... jeez.... people have forgotten that Great bands are all about SONGS, HOOKS, GROOVE and ATTITUDE. I personally care less about fast riffs or guitar solos... the songwriting these days is ridiculous. Metal bands are trying too hard to impress with their uber speed riffs and diminished scale wankery and metalcore with their dick in the throat "singing" style. What's the point when you don't have hooks and groove. Bands these days don't have any roots... they are influenced of bands from the generation before them but are totally unaware of the originals (from Robert Johnon and Charlie Parker to Zappa, Miles Davis, The Stones, The Who etc.) and lack depth and versality because of that.... and balls and attitude.... chugga chugga guitar riff doesn't equal attitude....but sticking fingers on girls' ass does
The early 80's were probably the last badass era in music... bands like Van Halen and whatnot... concerts were like parties, bands were bigger than life on the stage... chicks swinging on their dicks after the show.... had songs that were memoriable and had tons of attitude.... and full of groove wich made girls wet their pants and wanting to bang some random dudes on the backseat of a station wagon.
These days bands are faceless.... there aren't even decent frontmen anymore... like Mick Jagger, Plant, Steven Tyler, DLR etc. All that cookie monster or whining shit is a major weenie shrinker for me.
That being said.... it's a myth that metal is huge in Japan.... somehow everyone says that in US or Europe.... but when you are there... then you'll see it's not really true. In Japan... technical music is allways been appriciated and not bashed because of a certain trend (like Grunge in US) and the marketing works way better than in other places. There are as much metal fans in Japan as in US or Europe but they are a lot more supportive and loyal... average joe there visits way more concerts there and buys a lot more albums. But it's not "huge" in anyway . Mainstream is dominated by local J-Pop and J-Rock. VERY few foreign acts are HUGE there... one of them was Mr. Big.
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Post by thenotshredder on Jun 29, 2007 6:51:27 GMT -5
Funny, Mr. Big was huge. So you're saying that GREAT MUSIC IS ALL ABOUT MAKING GIRLS WANT SEX LOLZ?
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Post by entz on Jun 29, 2007 10:20:09 GMT -5
So you're saying that GREAT MUSIC IS ALL ABOUT MAKING GIRLS WANT SEX LOLZ? fuck yeah ;D
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Post by Stefvorcide on Jun 29, 2007 10:28:07 GMT -5
hehe true.
80's metal was dos as shites. too bad nones likes it anymore here, otherwise i wouldnt have a death metal band ;p
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Post by logansc on Jun 29, 2007 17:17:30 GMT -5
catchy music is stupid. and we call hooks breakdowns now, we have plenty of em, sometimes too many for me.
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Post by endless on Jul 1, 2007 0:27:43 GMT -5
Why do you listen to music if its not in some way catchy? Breakdowns are overdone, boring and very rarely do they have any 'hook' value to them. If you listen to whole songs just to hear the breakdowns(usually a bridge part), I'd call that pretty bad songwriting.
Regarding Japan/mainland Europe: perhaps huge was the wrong word to use, what I meant is that those areas are less fashion driven. There is less of the 'this is cool, so nothing else can be' attitude that is prevalent in North America. Therefor, there is a lot of support for a lot of different things, instead of scattered underground scenes amidst the 'all-powerful' mainstream. Just a few years ago, when bands like Arch Enemy we're little known here, they were treated like the backstreet boys in Japan. When Nevermore first toured Europe, they described it as 'walking into a time warp' back to the american 80's.
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Post by Stefvorcide on Jul 1, 2007 7:57:32 GMT -5
catchy music is stupid. and we call hooks breakdowns now, we have plenty of em, sometimes too many for me. catchy music is stupid, i tend to disagree. CHEEZY music is stupid. unoriginal music is stupid. Copying the previous band is stupid. Havin' a band for the sake of havin' a band is stupid IMO. Hell, ultra-technical/progressives bands like Spawn of Possession, Martyr, Cynic, Psycroptic, Augury, have CATCHY stuff, while not being cheezy, overdone at all. In fact, when you thought you heard every single metal riff, and listen to Martyr's "Warp zone" You get to hear new things every 10 seconds;p As for those cliché breakdowns, they're overdone as hell, IMO its like they dont have any creativity/ideas, so they just redo what the previous band played. its like they musicaly admit to have no inspirations at all. Fuck those bands. Nice breakdowns would have odd-beats and "nice" chords, not open-powerchords in drop-C.... I wouldn't play in a band that, lets say is doing what Slayer did 10-15-20 years ago. Even a band who's there for 5 years. Hell, I wouldn't copy my fav bands style. On the opposite, VORfuckingCIDE is all about originality, experimentation. We have *OUR* sound, our kind of riffs, our kind of harmonies/twin guitar parts, our kind of drummin' style (its not just keepin up the tempo) etc etc.... We've got no breakdown, no cheezy-ass pointless pedaltone riffs, no E-G-Dm-E progressions etc etc. Yeah, its never going to be popular, most ppl wont like/understand teh music, so what ? We just fucking do what we love. We're kinda doin' that extreme-metal thing, while at the same time, we're not downtuned, we dont have endless blastbeats... anyway
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Post by logansc on Jul 1, 2007 21:29:14 GMT -5
catchy music is stupid. and we call hooks breakdowns now, we have plenty of em, sometimes too many for me. You notice how I say sometimes I think there are too many breakdowns, not that I support them. I just don't like hooks either. When I say catchy I mean stuff that gets stuck in your head. That stuff is stupid, it should be a new experience every time.
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Post by entz on Jul 2, 2007 2:53:14 GMT -5
ahaaa, everyone with some musical ability can come up with furious riffs, polyrhytmic drum beats, wanking solos... ridiculous chord structures... 15 minutes wank-fest with different time signatures and whatnot, I know that stuff too well as I've done that... gets booring after a while. Everyone can come up with insane shit and call it "ART". But creating a 3 minute pop-rock tune is 10 times more challenging. Instead of thinking how to impress other players you have to be very anal about arrangements, vocal melodies, the melody of the chord progression, the dynamics etc. etc. so EVERYONE (not only other musicians) would pay attention. Impressing other musicians is the least important thing. I rather impress a 20 year old blond with wicked bewbs than a Berklee graduate.
writing cathcy stuff is the ultimate musicality, it's the hardest thing to do PERIOD. Music should be memoriable. Good songwriting skills are by far the most appriciated by any proffesional musicians. Ask anyone who is pro. Great music is NOT stupid.
Want a new experience all the time.... go to underground avant-garde jazz events. Pretty cool shit, you don't hear any recognizable melody at all LOL.
To me bands like Megadeth present what is good metal. They have a lot of skill but they are songwriters FIRST. A lot of catchy hooks and very melodic chord progressions.
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Post by pcsmall on Jul 2, 2007 10:50:31 GMT -5
ahaaa, everyone with some musical ability can come up with furious riffs, polyrhytmic drum beats, wanking solos... ridiculous chord structures... 15 minutes wank-fest with different time signatures and whatnot, I know that stuff too well as I've done that... gets booring after a while. Everyone can come up with insane shit and call it "ART". But creating a 3 minute pop-rock tune is 10 times more challenging. Instead of thinking how to impress other players you have to be very anal about arrangements, vocal melodies, the melody of the chord progression, the dynamics etc. etc. so EVERYONE (not only other musicians) would pay attention. Impressing other musicians is the least important thing. I rather impress a 20 year old blond with wicked bewbs than a Berklee graduate. writing cathcy stuff is the ultimate musicality, it's the hardest thing to do PERIOD. Music should be memoriable. Good songwriting skills are by far the most appriciated by any proffesional musicians. Ask anyone who is pro. Great music is NOT stupid. Want a new experience all the time.... go to underground avant-garde jazz events. Pretty cool shit, you don't hear any recognizable melody at all LOL. To me bands like Megadeth present what is good metal. They have a lot of skill but they are songwriters FIRST. A lot of catchy hooks and very melodic chord progressions. what he said...
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Post by entz on Jul 3, 2007 6:21:55 GMT -5
I still appriciate "technical" music... and have respect for skillful musicians who are capable of playing many different things.
The kind of "technical" stuff I like mostly isn't heavy metal music wich most of the folks here are into... I'm a fan of flamenco, jazz, latin etc. I love Al Di Meola.... not because he has a ridiculously good technique but the music he writes is very melodic, rhythmic and sexual.
I think there are some good technical metal out there too. I think Cynic was a great band. Those guys were the real deal and knew exactly what they were doing. Their tunes had common ground and not random wankfest all the time. You can hear pretty clearly that they were deeply into other styles of music and studied all the different stuff seriously... as they sounded real and sincere. They get my respect although I'm not a fan.
But seriously most of the stuff wich is being labeled as "progressive metal" is horseshit these days. The original bands were great and had a lot of melody and good writing skills. I loved (and still do) King's X and Queensryche, fucking amazing bands. Fates Warning was great. Watchtower, Crimson Glory, Voivod etc. were ok although I wasn't into them. But then tons of ridiculous bands came out... no songs... only wank wank wank. They don't have anything in commong with real "progressive" bands. They sound more like dragon-humping power metal bands.
When Tool came out it was like a breath of fresh air... a heavy guitar band with real prog elements. Funny, they are the only progressive "metal" band wich has a huge mainstream success after Queensryche. "Shred" fans seem to dislike Tool, but I think they are awsome, they have a lot more in commong with original prog rock bands like King Crimson, Genesis, Yes, Pink Floyd, Gentle Giant, Emerson Lake & Palmer, Moody Blues, Jethro Tull, Canterbury bands etc. than all the wank bands combined. Progressive music was never about ridiculous solos and whatnot. It was all about the vibe, the experimentation, the groove, the sounds etc.
Just put on Queensryche's "Operation Mindcrime" or "Empire"... now that's some good prog metal there. The songs are great, the musicianship is great, the arrangements are fantastic, the vibe is cool and the rhythm section grooves like a motherfucker.
Most of the stuff is horrible what you hear today. Take a band like Cynic and turn it 180 degrees around and then you have a bunch of jerk-offs trying to outplay each other.
I don't want to upset the fans but some band called Spiral Architect gave me a bigger headache than the Backstreet Boys ever could. I heard all these metalheads talking about them all the time.... how great they are and whatnot. So I started listening.... and couldn't belive how horrible it was. I read somewhere that they are mixing jazz with metal. Jeez, there's zero jazz there. They are a bunch of extreme metal players who are TRYING to use some jazz licks. It's not working, it sounds superficial and lame. They don't have any idea what jazz is. They are doing the exact opposite how music is should be done, it sounds like an unsynchronized slop. It's a total mess, they are avoiding any "team-play", groove, arrangements etc. anything wich makes a band sound like a band. And that bass player they have is probably the most horrible player I've ever heard. First his tone is beyond suckness. Then he totally avoids playing together with the drummer. His timing his horrible. No sense of groove. His dynamics are ridiculous.... every note he plays has a totally different volume level. Pal, learn how to play some Ramones first before you want to do "jazz", nobody cares how fast you are.
This is what separates men from boys. Anal Architect tryes but Cynic actually does.
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Post by pcsmall on Jul 3, 2007 7:31:24 GMT -5
king's x is one of my all-time favorite bands
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Post by Stefvorcide on Jul 3, 2007 9:31:26 GMT -5
Endrikk. there's no jazz in Spiral architect, its progressive.. arrangements are awesome, riffs are dos (a few are catchy too) and I dunno how you can say that ASGEIR MICKELSON sucks, but he's one of Norways best drummer dude (along with hellhammer imo) And the bass was MADE to be off-beat with the drums. its so badass. listen to A sceptic's universe again
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Post by entz on Jul 6, 2007 4:54:27 GMT -5
dude, I'm not saying they can't play.... the guitarists are good, the drummer is decent but lacks the percision wich polyrhythm masters like Vinnie Colaiuta have. they can play... but what they play sucks in my opinion... they don't play as a BAND, they are playing against each other.... it's a totall mess man.... the late 70's and early 80's Frank Zappa is the sickest prog shit you'll ever hear... but the whole band is tight as hell. but I still repeat... the bass player sucks dead donkey balls.... his playing so loose and lacks percision... and plays uneccesary shit at the wrong time... the whole band is weak on the low end because of that... doesn't have any balls becaus the bass is missing... instead you have a frustated guitarist playing bass. the first song here... Insect www.myspace.com/unofficialspiralarchitectlisten clearly how off the bass is.... playing off-beat with the drums is mathematically calculated precise timing... for example you divide the bar into 10 different parts... drummer chooses some of the parts and bass player the others where some wouldn't match with the drummers.... but this guys is playing stuff like 3,4...7,8 not 3...8 wich would be precise polyrhythm. And then all his notes have different volume levels. And his tone is horrendus. Look at this way... if there's an experimental band where twelve-tone technique is ok.... you can play all the notes... they are not "in the scale" but can be cool in the context.... in the world of rhythms that would be equal to polyrhythms.... if we would take this dudes rhythmic "sense" and use it in the world of melody... then this guy doesn't use any of the 12 notes.... he uses the notes wich are between the two keys
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Post by entz on Jul 7, 2007 2:48:13 GMT -5
btw. there's many way more advanced drummers in Norway... technique and groove vise... and have played with some major artists. Erik Smith, Torstein Lofthus, Paal Nilssen etc.
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